Leveling Kits. Who’s got em - Page 2

Leveling Kits. Who’s got em

This is a discussion on Leveling Kits. Who’s got em within the 2nd Gen F150 Ecoboost forums, part of the 2nd Gen F150 Ecoboost Forum (2015+) category; My truck beat you to death off road stock too, not much difference that I can tell. I absolutely wouldn't argue that there is no ...

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  1. #11
    Super Moderator mwemaxxowner's Avatar
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    My truck beat you to death off road stock too, not much difference that I can tell. I absolutely wouldn't argue that there is no change, just not that I actually notice. Off road was rough before and after, on the street isn't much different. I would imagine once the shocks are upgraded it'll be fine.

    I fail to see whether adding length to the strut assembly with a puck or whether adding it with a longer shock would make any difference geometrically. It does the same thing to the control arms and the droop, no?
    @GearHead_1 (He and @[email protected] with stage three are my go to suspension advice guys. Lol)

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    Last edited by mwemaxxowner; 05-05-2019 at 01:13 PM.
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    Sponsor Jason@Stage3's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by mwemaxxowner View Post
    I fail to see whether adding length to the strut assembly with a puck or whether adding it with a longer shock would make any difference geometrically. It does the same thing to the control arms and the droop, no?
    @GearHead_1 (He and @[email protected] with stage three are my go to suspension advice guys. Lol)
    From a pure geometry standpoint, there’s not a difference between a strut spacer leveling kit and a coilover/leveled strut.

    That being said, geometry (or lack thereof) is only one factor in determining ride quality and performance on or off road.

  3. #13
    Eco-Beast EcoXLT's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
    From a pure geometry standpoint, there’s not a difference between a strut spacer leveling kit and a coilover/leveled strut.

    That being said, geometry (or lack thereof) is only one factor in determining ride quality and performance on or off road.
    And technically doesn’t the puck let the suspension drop farther. the thickness of the puck. And your suspension isn’t designed to drop 2.5 inches farther then stock. Bilstien 5100 are stock length ? Don’t know if I’m explaining that correctly.
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  5. #14
    Ecoboost Master GearHead_1's Avatar

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    The geometry is pretty much the same either way as the truck sits with weight on it. I’m making this next statement half cocked as I haven’t really measured the Ford verses Bilstein coil over assembly lengths. As I understand it, the Bilstein assembly when fully extended is the same length as the factory coil over dimension. It simply squeezes the spring tighter resulting in lift. The coil over assembly is the limiter when it comes to full droop on these suspensions. The block will however allow the control arm/s to droop the extra height of the block potentially putting more strain on ball joints, sway bar links, control arm bushings etc. at full droop.

    In essence the packaged length of the assembly becomes coil over plus block height vs. OEM length. In my mind the potential for over extension on these pieces could result in accelerated wear. Keep in mind that in either case these pieces are working closer to their designed limits than Ford intended so one could make a case that either way you go you might accelerate wear. Unless I were able to run an A vs. B vs. C comparison I have no idea if this really happens, I suspect it does.

    I’m helping a friend put a set on his 2018 this Friday. I’ll try to take actual measurements of the intact assemblies.
    Last edited by GearHead_1; 05-05-2019 at 07:32 PM.
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    Eco-Beast winchested's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHead_1 View Post
    The geometry is pretty much the same either way as the truck sits with weight on it. Iím making this next statement half cocked as I havenít really measured the Ford verses Bilstein coil over assembly lengths. As I understand it, the Bilstein assembly when fully extended is the same length as the factory coil over dimension. It simply squeezes the spring tighter resulting in lift. The coil over assembly is the limiter when it comes to full droop on these suspensions. The block will however allow the control arm/s to droop the extra height of the block potentially putting more strain on ball joints, sway bar links, control arm bushings etc. at full droop.

    In essence the packaged length of the assembly becomes coil over plus block height vs. OEM length. In my mind the potential for over extension on these pieces could result in accelerated wear. Keep in mind that in either case these pieces are working closer to their designed limits than Ford intended so one could make a case that either way you go you might accelerate wear. Unless I were able to run an A vs. B vs. C comparison I have no idea if this really happens, I suspect it does.

    Iím helping a friend put a set on his 2018 this Friday. Iíll try to take actual measurements of the intact assemblies.
    Yes but this is about ride feel not wear.

    I drove on a 2" level kit for 30k km. It felt zero different than driving sans 2" aluminum puck.

    Seriously how many guys on just levelling kits are out hitting full droop on an IFS suspension and stock coil overs... Um practically zero.


    The upper control arm geometry may change but the physical feel of the suspension and drove does not change.

    My only complaint was the hollow feeling you got over wash board feedback from the steering rack.

    But that's steering feel not ride.
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    Ecoboost Master GearHead_1's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by winchested View Post
    Yes but this is about ride feel not wear...
    Actually the thread was about who’s got’em. Wasn’t making a case for what THIS was about but at least I know now. Just making a comment on potential consequences. Admittedly I’ve never run a set of pucks. I can’t speak to their ride quality in any way meaningful.

    I personally like a firmer ride and Bilstein’s are certainly firmer than OE.
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    Quote Originally Posted by winchested View Post
    Yes but this is about ride feel not wear.

    I drove on a 2" level kit for 30k km. It felt zero different than driving sans 2" aluminum puck.

    Seriously how many guys on just levelling kits are out hitting full droop on an IFS suspension and stock coil overs... Um practically zero.


    The upper control arm geometry may change but the physical feel of the suspension and drove does not change.

    My only complaint was the hollow feeling you got over wash board feedback from the steering rack.

    But that's steering feel not ride.
    Yeah with a puck,technically you would have to get air to droop the suspension to far. Or any time you jack the vehicle up by the frame.
    By the way Jason brought up geometry and it’s a valid point. Not the first time a thread went in a different direction.
    Ill be curious what measurements Gearhead comes up with. I think I read they should be the same as stock. So no extra droop. But since it’s lifted you get to maximum droop sooner.
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    Super Moderator mwemaxxowner's Avatar
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    I'm having a hard time getting my mind around how you achieve the same ride height without the same distance between the top and bottom of the strut mounts .

    Spacer is easy. It goes on top of my strut and makes it longer. So we have that out of the way.

    Bilsteins, if they are the same length, I guess achieve the height by putting more preload on the spring. If this is the case, doesn't that cause the shock to extend...making it longer? (To achieve an identical ride height to the spacer)


    Edit-I'm guessing since the lift is coming from preload, the difference is that once the shock is fully extended that's it. You're not overextending anything, you're just limiting yourself to less down travel more or less. (I think I'm getting it now. Lol)

    At any rate, I haven't noticed much of anything that is less desirable after adding my 2.5" spacers. I've seen Jason say as far as increased wear we're okay at 2.5 but no more, so that's good enough for me in that department. If I have to service some parts sooner due to that it's okay. Soon I'll be upgrading my shocks and I think she's going to ride well.


    Edit. Found some specs, I'll look for these same specs soon for oem shocks.



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    Last edited by mwemaxxowner; 05-06-2019 at 09:02 AM.

  10. #19
    Ecoboost Jr Member polyol's Avatar

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    The spacer just compresses the spring, pretty simple. Its not ideal but hey, many of us have it and it works.

  11. #20
    Sponsor Jason@Stage3's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by EcoXLT View Post
    And technically doesnít the puck let the suspension drop farther. the thickness of the puck. And your suspension isnít designed to drop 2.5 inches farther then stock. Bilstien 5100 are stock length ? Donít know if Iím explaining that correctly.
    Not really. Increased ride height is increased ride height regardless of how it's achieved. The Bilstein 5100s are at least close to stock length. They add ride height via spring preload, but it still throws off geometry/angles regardless.

    Quote Originally Posted by GearHead_1 View Post
    The geometry is pretty much the same either way as the truck sits with weight on it. Iím making this next statement half cocked as I havenít really measured the Ford verses Bilstein coil over assembly lengths. As I understand it, the Bilstein assembly when fully extended is the same length as the factory coil over dimension.
    It's at least close. I'm not sure if it's 100% dead-on the same, but it's close enough to not make a difference with the perch settings for the spring.

    In my mind the potential for over extension on these pieces could result in accelerated wear. Keep in mind that in either case these pieces are working closer to their designed limits than Ford intended so one could make a case that either way you go you might accelerate wear. Unless I were able to run an A vs. B vs. C comparison I have no idea if this really happens, I suspect it does.
    While extra wear is technically the case, the real question (which probably can't be answered due to sample size issues) is whether or not the "extra" wear actually causes more failures on a long enough timeline than the variances of quality in the stock hardware to begin with.

    In our experience, I've got to say it's not anywhere near as big of an issue as it's made out to be.

    Quote Originally Posted by mwemaxxowner View Post
    I'm having a hard time getting my mind around how you achieve the same ride height without the same distance between the top and bottom of the strut mounts .

    Spacer is easy. It goes on top of my strut and makes it longer. So we have that out of the way.

    Bilsteins, if they are the same length, I guess achieve the height by putting more preload on the spring. If this is the case, doesn't that cause the shock to extend...making it longer? (To achieve an identical ride height to the spacer)

    Edit-I'm guessing since the lift is coming from preload, the difference is that once the shock is fully extended that's it. You're not overextending anything, you're just limiting yourself to less down travel more or less. (I think I'm getting it now. Lol)
    The key word here is "ride height" which is where the truck rides on a level surface. Both spacers and preload-based leveling kits have the same effect on geometry and downtravel, just via different methods.

    At any rate, I haven't noticed much of anything that is less desirable after adding my 2.5" spacers. I've seen Jason say as far as increased wear we're okay at 2.5 but no more, so that's good enough for me in that department. If I have to service some parts sooner due to that it's okay. Soon I'll be upgrading my shocks and I think she's going to ride well.
    We recommend not going beyond 2.5" of leveling with the factory UCAs. You already risk spring contact with the stock UCAs at that point.

    In theory, you can go up to about 3" with aftermarket UCAs, but you'd be pushing it.

    My truck's been at 2.75" over stock on a set of Halo Lifts coilovers for nearly three years now, and no issues other than the fact that the uniballs in my FabTech UCAs have about had it.

    Quote Originally Posted by polyol View Post
    The spacer just compresses the spring, pretty simple. Its not ideal but hey, many of us have it and it works.
    If you're talking about a preload spacer (and there are some kits that use those), then yes. If you're talking about a strut spacer, then no. Strut spacers just increase the length of the strut assembly, and don't have anything to do with the coilover spring.

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