[stvsbc]

Oh I wouldn’t run both. And I probably won’t do nitrous, if I did, I’d ditch the meth kit. But, Jason Myers is at Livernois motorsports right now getting his truck tuned with stage 5 turbos and a fuel pump. It’s a 2021 powerboost. He has the nitrous kit on it and has had it on there for a little while now, it made 640hp and 700 something torque on that setup with stock turbos and I think a 50 shot. He texted me the other day and said Livernois just did his new dyno pulls and the hp number started with a 7. So he is really pushing it… and I’m really curious to see how it goes. (He ran nitrous on the stock tune and it was fine with it)

You and I both know what comes next for him. The same thing that is gonna happen to mine. I hope he is prepared for carnage.

BTW, I have had a Snow Performance methanol injection system on my truck for three years plus. I absolutely love it!

 

[boostkingMatt]

You and I both know what comes next for him. The same thing that is gonna happen to mine. I hope he is prepared for carnage.

BTW, I have had a Snow Performance methanol injection system on my truck for three years plus. I absolutely love it!

Yeah even though the newer 3.5 is stronger than the older ones, I don’t think his is going to last at over 700whp I hate to say. Like you said, I hope he’s prepared and has a backup plan.

really? Sweet, that’s good to hear. Where did you end up putting the tank? And do you mix your own or use boost juice?

 

[stvsbc]

I fabricated a pump bracket and a tank bracket that placed the pump out of harms way on the inner frame rail below the airbox and placed the tank angled between the fan shroud and the airbox. The fill lid is right next to the intake tube. I'll see if I can get a pic tonight.

And I mix my own. One gallon of winter blend washer fluid and three bottles of yellow Heet. According to Snow's own instructions, that should yield a 51% concentration. Mainly go that route so I don't have to worry about keeping boost juice on hand. Ingredients are readily available anywhere and the cost is roughly the same, if not a bit cheaper, than Boost Juice.

 

[Upshifter]

Yeah even though the newer 3.5 is stronger than the older ones, I don’t think his is going to last at over 700whp I hate to say. Like you said, I hope he’s prepared and has a backup plan.

really? Sweet, that’s good to hear. Where did you end up putting the tank? And do you mix your own or use boost juice?

I was gonna say.... starts with a 7??? On purpose??

If the 21+ blocks are living happily at those levels, we are grossly under-selling the Gen3 upgrades!!
I thought it was basically phasers and crank. I'd have to think forged rods and pistons are a must at those power levels too, regardless of how strong the crank is.

 

[boosted1469]

The reason I was going to have Ford do the tune is the warranty. I don't want a warranty I can't use

 

[Upshifter]

The reason I was going to have Ford do the tune is the warranty. I don't want a warranty I can't use

Fair enough, as that would be the only reason to use that tune. And for many, plenty reason enough.

Claims that aftermarket tunes do not void warranty or cannot be detected lack specific nuances so as to be misleading, at best, or are downright dubious at worst.

In my opinion whether a tune can be detected simply depends on how deep the dealer collaborates with Ford corporate to look for it. I don't think it can be claimed that they are undetectable. Only that often dealers don't bother to do any detecting, let alone pursue the effort to mount such an allegation and tie it to the cause of some failure as a means to deny a warranty claim.

 

[boosted1469]

Thanks I appreciate it

 

[boostkingMatt]

I was gonna say.... starts with a 7??? On purpose??

If the 21+ blocks are living happily at those levels, we are grossly under-selling the Gen3 upgrades!!
I thought it was basically phasers and crank. I'd have to think forged rods and pistons are a must at those power levels too, regardless of how strong the crank is.

Yeah he made over 700whp on a powerboost. Like holy crapoly. Well the Gen 3 has better phasers, metal timing chain guides, coyote valvetrain, and a much stronger piston than the Gen 2 has. The rods are the same, and the crank might be a bit different I’m not sure but I think all Ecoboost cranks are forged steel.

 

[snakebitten]

I wasn't aware of the changes to pistons. That was low hanging fruit. Good to hear.

 

[Gord0]

I wasn't aware of the changes to pistons. That was low hanging fruit. Good to hear.

I wasn't either. They were probably the weakest point in the 3.5

 

[Boatwaco]

I wasn't either. They were probably the weakest point in the 3.5

I don’t know, I thought the weakest point was the side of the block where the connecting rods would poke out?

 

[Gord0]

I don’t know, I thought the weakest point was the side of the block where the connecting rods would poke out?

Inspection windows were usually installed by rods after a piston breaking.

 

[Boatwaco]

Right! Cause and effect!

 

[SrpRacing]

Yeah he made over 700whp on a powerboost. Like holy crapoly. Well the Gen 3 has better phasers, metal timing chain guides, coyote valvetrain, and a much stronger piston than the Gen 2 has. The rods are the same, and the crank might be a bit different I’m not sure but I think all Ecoboost cranks are forged steel.

This was from COBB-
Definitely a lot of changes. Compression ratio is higher than Gen2 as mentioned earlier, turbos are different (greater compressor efficiency at higher airmass per Ford's modeled CoE), HPFP runs a few hundred PSI higher at WOT, smaller port injectors, smaller direct injectors (although pressure increase from HPFP will actually increase total DI fueling capacity). Likely some other changes to cam profile and intake/exhaust manifold design as there are some VE changes in the factory fueling model. And an emissions category lower at ULEV50 (Federal Tier 3 Bin 50/California LEV-III ULEV50) which is really impressive - these emissions categories are determined by the total mass of specific pollutants (NMOG+NOx) per mile, not per gallon of gas used. So for a relatively high fuel consuming vehicle like the Raptor, hitting this low emissions category is surprising.

 

[snakebitten]

Inspection windows were usually installed by rods after a piston breaking.

Yep, and rods get blamed often when it was really a Piston losing integrity first.

 

[snakebitten]

As I recall, the heads and phasers are really the only big change from Gen2 to Gen3. Turbos also. But mainly accommodations for the EGR.

This was from COBB-
Definitely a lot of changes. Compression ratio is higher than Gen2 as mentioned earlier, turbos are different (greater compressor efficiency at higher airmass per Ford's modeled CoE), HPFP runs a few hundred PSI higher at WOT, smaller port injectors, smaller direct injectors (although pressure increase from HPFP will actually increase total DI fueling capacity). Likely some other changes to cam profile and intake/exhaust manifold design as there are some VE changes in the factory fueling model. And an emissions category lower at ULEV50 (Federal Tier 3 Bin 50/California LEV-III ULEV50) which is really impressive - these emissions categories are determined by the total mass of specific pollutants (NMOG+NOx) per mile, not per gallon of gas used. So for a relatively high fuel consuming vehicle like the Raptor, hitting this low emissions category is surprising.

Who said coyote valve train and metal timing chain guides?

Picture posted by full-race Geoff

 

[SrpRacing]

Thanks @snakebitten. My mind was somewhere else.

 

[snakebitten]

Thanks @snakebitten. My mind was somewhere else.

No worries.
I'm not sure the Gen3 actually got the Coyote lifters/rollers, or that you can use them?
I do remember Geoff recommending the swap if you were refreshing/building a Gen2.

 

[boostkingMatt]

I wasn't aware of the changes to pistons. That was low hanging fruit. Good to hear.

Yeah it’s pretty cool, if you go look on ford parts, you’ll see a totally different piston for 7/19/21 and up, and it ain’t cheap!! 141$ for one.

 

[boostkingMatt]

No worries.
I'm not sure the Gen3 actually got the Coyote lifters/rollers, or that you can use them?
I do remember Geoff recommending the swap if you were refreshing/building a Gen2.

Geoff said it had coyote valvetrain.

from Full-Race’s article


Major improvements include the all-new and unique Gen3 block and heads, with “ML3Z” phasers, metal timing chain guides, new timing chain tensioners, along with a 3675psi / 250bar direct-injection fuel system.

The Harmonic Balancer receives a massive redesign and looks more like a racing car crank pulley. This necessitated Ford to relocate the AC compressor farther forward and that actually makes accessing and upgrading your Gen3’s turbos much easier.

With enhancements like a 250-bar fuel injection system, 5.0L Coyote valvetrain and the strongest piston/crank combination yet—all GEN3 engines are now built to the same internal specifications.”