Still can't buy them though!!! I bet demand is through the roof, even at that price.

I'm so on the fence on whether I retain the BD manis & stock turbos and just get this project done, or I pony up around $4k for these manis and some Garret PowerMax turbos...

My truck (not me!) is having an identity crisis, and I blame .NET!

I'm not making it a rocket but I think I want to keep it for another 100k miles.
Even with big turbos I don't expect I'd be any faster than a Gen 2 with a mild tune.

Rather, I'm thinking getting a bit more power with a bit less boost and heat will help, and a bit more fun is always welcome.

But as usual, I digress...

 

Still can't buy them though!!! I bet demand is through the roof, even at that price.

I'm so on the fence on whether I retain the BD manis & stock turbos and just get this project done, or I pony up around $4k for these manis and some Garret PowerMax turbos...

My truck (not me!) is having an identity crisis, and I blame .NET!

I'm not making it a rocket but I think I want to keep it for another 100k miles.
Even with big turbos I don't expect I'd be any faster than a Gen 2 with a mild tune.

Rather, I'm thinking getting a bit more power with a bit less boost and heat will help, and a bit more fun is always welcome.

But as usual, I digress...

Do it. You won’t regret it. Trust me. Just the sound that comes from them is worth it.

 

Bad influence haha

 

I may bite that bullet but I don't want to just replace manifolds. When I'm in there I want to waste more by upgrading the turbos too!

 

See! You get it.

Any opportunity to flush $$ away, sign me up.

 

I’ve started a trend…

 

"available now!" and "coming soon . . ." seem to suggest different things.

I am still slightly irritated that they went through all this effort to design these and didnt put a bolt at the top of the rear port.

 

I am still slightly irritated that they went through all this effort to design these and didnt put a bolt at the top of the rear port.

I think thats the only thing keeping this from being a no-brainer for me.

The flange still looks super thick, and reading all their material it seems their strategy is all-in on managing heat as the means to side-step the warping issue.
But there is still the issue of the weight of the turbo itself, just hanging their in space...

 

As I said in another thread, they may hold up for a few trips down the strip. But I’m not sure how well they will hold up to constant towing. EGTs will be much higher for a longer period of time.

We shall see.

 

As I said in another thread, they may hold up for a few trips down the strip. But I’m not sure how well they will hold up to constant towing. EGTs will be much higher for a longer period of time.

We shall see.

Exactly. Regardless of what metal they use, its softening as it gets hotter. I dont believe that 347SS is any stronger than 316SS or carbon steel at 1500F, but I could be wrong. They may not warp but the sagging is what scares me.

 

If it really is Turbo weight.....
And it reminds me of how braces on our teeth work...... Not necessarily a strong force, but rather one that is ceaseless and eventually wins the tugowar match.

So in that context, if someone was to design a support that is attached to the structure of the truck and then a mechanism for that support to "pull", if from above, and "hold" if from below.

Imagine a less cluttered engine bay with a shock tower brace. Then attach a strap from the Turbos to the shock tower brace.

Problem is, don't the Turbos move with the block as it twists under torque?
Then the brace would have to be attached to the engine and move with it?

Just spitballing.
If it were feasible, I'm guessing someone would have already mocked up an attempt.

 

If it really is Turbo weight.....
And it reminds me of how braces on our teeth work...... Not necessarily a strong force, but rather one that is ceaseless and eventually wins the tugowar match.

So in that context, if someone was to design a support that is attached to the structure of the truck and then a mechanism for that support to "pull", if from above, and "hold" if from below.

Imagine a less cluttered engine bay with a shock tower brace. Then attach a strap from the Turbos to the shock tower brace.

Problem is, don't the Turbos move with the block as it twists under torque?
Then the brace would have to be attached to the engine and move with it?

Just spitballing.
If it were feasible, I'm guessing someone would have already mocked up an attempt.

Yeah the turbos move too. That’s a great idea though, however don’t think it would work. Just need a better way to mount the turbos. The 2.7 doesn’t have any problems like that because of its integrated manifolds in the cylinder head. Turbo bolts solidly right to the head. They should design the 3.5 like that too.

 

I'm looking forward to trying them. As mentioned before, I get the apprehension given the "missing" mount point. However, these are designed completely different than any other offering. With the runner design, there just isn't any way to get that mount point in there and it keeps heat away from the flange. SS will dissipate the heat better than Carbon Steel as well.

I'll be towing long distance with them, so they will be put to the test. It didn't take me very long to warp the CRP's, that's for sure.

 

I'm looking forward to trying them. As mentioned before, I get the apprehension given the "missing" mount point. However, these are designed completely different than any other offering. With the runner design, there just isn't any way to get that mount point in there and it keeps heat away from the flange. SS will dissipate the heat better than Carbon Steel as well.

I'll be towing long distance with them, so they will be put to the test. It didn't take me very long to warp the CRP's, that's for sure.

I hope they work, I really do. I just don't wanna spend my $1000 and time installing them to find out. So for that I thank you

 

Just an FYI. Talked with @full-race geoff and these manifolds are in stock now. I hope to have a set along with Garret Stage 2's shipping out shortly! I'm very excited!

Edit: Available now for Gen1's.

 

Just an FYI. Talked with @full-race geoff and these manifolds are in stock now. I hope to have a set along with Garret Stage 2's shipping out shortly! I'm very excited!

2017+ Garrett stage 2's? What do you do with the hot side, I thought the turbine was bigger than stock.

 

Thanks for chiming in on the thread Geoff, much appreciated!

 

Don't have a Gen1 with a warped exhaust manifold. But if I did it'd be difficult to not pony up for a set.

Thank you for the vote of confidence. Full Race has never and will never use cast iron for any turbocharged gas engine. When I saw what people were putting on their trucks the last couple years it gave me heartburn knowing you would fail and be in the same predicament. but I never like to air dirty laundry in public and try not to talk negatively in a public forum

So do you think the target customer for these Full Race manifolds are tuned heavy towing (relative) Gen1 F150's? … Still, if I had to bet, I think there's considerable overlap in what would make a robust manifold and what would make a Full Race approved manifold. They don't weld that tag on anything lightly, in my opinion.

correct assumption. reliability during extreme use (like towing) was our #1 target. EGT was 2nd and fitting bigger performance turbos was 3rd.

You can get these and test em, and ill test the new OEM ones, and we can compare notes.

I agree, Friends dont let friends use cast iron on turbo gas engines! The decision most people should looking at are the new OEM V2 stainless manifolds or the formline stainless manifolds. The OEM manifold turbine outlet is still undersized and the runners are restrictive, the flanges are still thin, but its the best option for low cost. And if i were in your position after being burned by cast iron 3x id probably be a bit gun shy to try anything aftermarket

The CRP's are burly, and better steel, but they still pull away from the head in that same spot without popping the studs, at least not in my case. I allegedly "warped" 3 CRP's and my studs were all there. Stainless steel is not actually stronger.

stainless steel is massively stronger at temp and in a corrosive environment like gasoline engine exhaust there's no comparison.

Respectfully, I believe CRP is not a superior material to OEM... hence your experience. Sand-cast iron (CRP) and the other slightly better option of sand-cast Hi-Sil-Mol (BD Diesel). Neither material is suitable for a turbocharged gasoline truck application. Every modern performance gasoline engine has a stainless turbine housing and manifold for this reason. Garrett stopped using cast iron housings on all their performance turbos in 2008 for this exact warping/cracking concern. Garrett switched to ni-resist for cheaper turbos and 347 stainless for the high end g series

I’ll probably end up getting the full race manifolds once they come out, although they haven’t shipped my turbo adapters yet and it’s been 10 days since I ordered them lol and they haven’t responded to my email inquiry I sent about it a couple days ago, hopefully they are just busy or something… They just emailed me back and said that they ran out of hardware for them so might be a little bit to get it back in stock.

I apologize if you did not get a prompt response while we were away at PRI that week. We brought the entire team out to Indianapolis and the office only had 1 guy answering phones. that was a mistake. The whole team regrets that customers didnt get the attention that they deserve that week. It won’t happen again, some of our guys are staying behind next year. thank you for your patience!.

Thanks for chiming in on the thread Geoff, much appreciated!

my pleasure. happy to answer any other questions you have

 

stainless steel is massively stronger at temp and in a corrosive environment like gasoline engine exhaust there's no comparison.

Respectfully, I believe CRP is not a superior material to OEM... hence your experience. Sand-cast iron (CRP) and the other slightly better option of sand-cast Hi-Sil-Mol (BD Diesel). Neither material is suitable for a turbocharged gasoline truck application. Every modern performance gasoline engine has a stainless turbine housing and manifold for this reason. Garrett stopped using cast iron housings on all their performance turbos in 2008 for this exact warping/cracking concern. Garrett switched to ni-resist for cheaper turbos and 347 stainless for the high end g series

My understand from doing work in fire protection of stainless and carbon steel assets in oil refineries and chemical plants, that stainless steels yield strength was no better than carbon steels(lower at low temperatures), and in fact the structural failure points for stainless steel assets are generally at a lower temperature during a fire. Our fire testing temperatures are 2000-2350F.

Warping and cracking, for sure I can see it being better.

But maybe im missing something.

And to be clear, I am not arguing that the manifolds should be carbon steel. I am fully on board with the stainless options. I am running the stainless OEM manifolds on my truck right now instead of CRP's or BD's. My concern stems from the 9" gap between the two rear most upper studs. My CRP's pulled away from the rear most port without breaking studs

 

At my age it's STILL amazing to discover that I don't know what I don't know.

So glad I was born late enough to at least get to witness the information age, if you know what I mean. Forums are invaluable regarding.

 

At my age it's STILL amazing to discover that I don't know what I don't know. So glad I was born late enough to at least get to witness the information age, if you know what I mean. Forums are invaluable regarding.

love it - never ever stop learning. and for the record, gen2 is soo much easier than gen1

PM me a mailing address and count of the number of guys on the team in the office. I'll send each one of the team one of our F150Ecoboost.net decals - except that guy you left behind to answer the phones. He will get one regular and one of the retired 10th Anniversary decals! He earned it!

thank you, will do the guys will be pumped I walked out to the parking lot this morning and realized almost all our staff drives F150s from 2006 to 2022 in the lot

Warping and cracking, for sure I can see it being better. But maybe im missing something. And to be clear, I am not arguing that the manifolds should be carbon steel. I am fully on board with the stainless options. I am running the stainless OEM manifolds on my truck right now instead of CRP's or BD's. My concern stems from the 9" gap between the two rear most upper studs. My CRP's pulled away from the rear most port without breaking studs

Im not here to argue with you but there's no 9" gap.

not surprised that low grade cast iron was pulling away. im glad you are happy with the oem V2 stainless manifolds

 

Hey @full-race geoff - outstanding contribution to our forum and great information to help us understand what's what.
Thank you!

Please PM me a mailing address and count of the number of guys on the team in the office. I'll send each one of the team one of our F150Ecoboost.net decals - except that guy you left behind to answer the phones. He will get one regular and one of the retired 10th Anniversary decals! He earned it!

 

Some pics of the Stage 2’s bolted to the form line manifolds.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Some pics of the Stage 2’s bolted to the form line manifolds.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Those look like they’re bolted to gen1 manifolds too. Any more details?

 

I’m not any expert on metallurgy but I appreciate all the food for thought here!

Disclaimer: software engineer here, not mechanical.

One thing I haven’t seen mentioned is metal “memory”. E.g regardless of any expansion or Strength changes by temperature, what seems just as or possibly more important is if the shape will go back to normal.

Maybe this is where the material and design gains another advantage.

In theory if everything from the head to the studs to the turbine housing to the manifolds expands and returns in a somewhat consistent fashion, maybe it’s less important what the specific strengths are at specific temperatures? Or how many times the metal will return?


If I recall cast iron has little to no “tensile memory” if I’m remembering the term correctly.

 

@full-race geoff - The pics on your web page shows all the mounting hardware and gaskets. Does this come as a kit with new manifolds?

Also, what is the difference in choosing WITH or WITHOUT the GARRETT POWERMAX TURBOS?
I ask because I may just buy these now and wait until later to get turbos and do everythign at once but spread the cost out strating now.

Thanks for all you input!!

 

@full-race geoff - The pics on your web page shows all the mounting hardware and gaskets. Does this come as a kit with new manifolds?

Also, what is the difference in choosing WITH or WITHOUT the GARRETT POWERMAX TURBOS?
I ask because I may just buy these now and wait until later to get turbos and do everythign at once but spread the cost out strating now.

Thanks for all you input!!

From what I was told the manifolds ARE a kit which include gaskets, studs, and nuts; not 100% which gaskets and hardware are included though.

I was told the selection for Garrett powermax turbos includes an additional wastegate arm adapter thing.

On their website it currently does not allow you to add to cart with the powermax selection. You can add to the cart if you select “no powermax turbos”

 

Only history, which doesn't exist yet, is going to confirm whether what all the "testing" suggests. And I don't fault any scepticism since the Gen1 warped manifold fix has already been claimed in the past only to prove out to not be true.

But this time I personally believe does warrant fresh optimism. It's far from just another thick(er) lump of cast iron with an altered bolt pattern.

What sticks out in my mind is the term "huge project".

Thicker with altered bolt pattern wouldn't deserve such a description with any meaningful sincerity. It's obvious that so much more went into this than what our eyes could possibly see in a computer screen image.

 

FYI- Also currently unable to complete checkout due to “no shipping quote available”

 

Sweet! Mine will be shipping next week.


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This thread has been made a sticky.

 

Here’s what you get when you select the powermax option

 

When you select the Powermax option they assume you are using stage 2's from a Gen 2 and are converting to vacuum actuators?

 

Really nice looking kit.

 

Feel free to tease and poke fun at my terrible video skills.

I ordered the wrong size silicone couplers, so gotta get that sorted and then I can install.

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Feel free to tease and poke fun at my terrible video skills.

I ordered the wrong size silicone couplers, so gotta get that sorted and then I can install.
View attachment 185127
View attachment 185128
View attachment 185129


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So those are gen 1 turbine housings on gen 2 center's and compressor housings?

 

and for the record, its not possible to fit the stage2 garretts on any 11-16 manifold except formline

whoa!!!! wait.....so a Gen 1 truck can run the Stage 2 Garret turbos if you install the formline manifolds?

 

and for the record, its not possible to fit the stage2 garretts on any 11-16 manifold except formline

whoa!!!! wait.....so a Gen 1 truck can run the Stage 2 Garret turbos if you install the formline manifolds?

Not quite that simple, I have the only known modified Stage 2 set to pull this off at this time.
There are also some things that have to be done to be able to run the Gen2 water lines and Oil lines. Hopefully our little test here will be successful and Full Race can offer a "kit" or something to the masses.

 

Blown F150, once again, making sacrifices for the benefit of the collective. 😁

Although I jest, I really am both intrigued AND kinda thrilled to see fresh life breathed into the Gen1 platform. There's so many good reasons to invest in one these days too.

 

Huge thanks to Full Race really. None of this would be happening without Geoff.