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I just wonder why its not an issue for everybody if it was the timing tables. My OAR pretty much pegs at -.96 on any tune stock or otherwise. Occasionally, I might see it drop into the -.7 or -.8's, but never any lower. I am only on 91 here.
 

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Discussion Starter #22
When this is going on, and the OAR gets worse (goes more positive) my KR still acts the same as it ever does. Adds here, pulls there, pulls a lot at medium loads (and maxed out even) and the truck falls on its face.

As mentioned, I don't really let it happen like that any more. Usually a bump down a gear and a bit of throttle and I avoid it. I also avoid certain tunes. All 5* performance tunes are out for me and all adaptive tunes for everybody are out.

I will also gear down as needed ahead of time if I see a challenging hill coming, especially if I'm towing. Avoid a problem altogether.

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Also this reminds me I should add, If I ever go to driving it manually to try and avoid it the problem actually seems to get worse! especially downshifting!! If I downshift more than once it puts the OAR through the roof.
 

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Discussion Starter #23
I just wonder why its not an issue for everybody if it was the timing tables. My OAR pretty much pegs at -.96 on any tune stock or otherwise. Occasionally, I might see it drop into the -.7 or -.8's, but never any lower. I am only on 91 here.
My thoughts exactly! if this is a problem with anything to do with factory tuning to any degree then technically every single one of us should have the issue but it still seems to be a pretty small % effected so I am not convinced that is it . Just like the Gas thing people are having issues across different states and countries even, myself with any grade of fuel I try it makes no difference so I have a hard time believing that is it either.
 

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For me it's related to when rpms are low to medium and boost is on the high side (possibly LSPI). Downshifting gets the rpms up to match the boost and sometimes even drops the boost.

It also may be changing the harmonics of whatever is falsely tripping the knock sensors if that's what it is.

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I don't have a tuner to monitor any of our Ecoboost trucks, but mine. My truck doesn't behave this way.

I remember when I first came across the subject I purposely looked for the symptoms. But regardless of intentionally mimicking the driving conditions, I can't force +KR of any significance.

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I was getting the same thing as the OP. Got it fixed no problem. I also do my own tuning (Owner of Ortiz Performance) so I reworked my entire timing tables. Most of the time the tuner would rather send a tune and be good to go. Other times, it costs time to rework the timing tables as one of the members mentioned, even how much boost is being commanded at a certain rpm causing knock as well. The most common thing is false knock but since you mentioned you checked your exhaust already it may not be that.

If you have some spare time you can shoot me a pm and see if we can work it out no problem. I won't even charge a dime, just trying to help someone out.
 

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At what engine load does everybody’s KR turn on? On the current gearhead tune I have the KR is inactive until I exceed .8 load. Perhaps some strategy codes turn the KR on at a lower load
 

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I don't know, but my Gearhead tune was one of the worst in regards to the high knock and OAR fluctuations we're talking about.

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As you know, my GearHead tune is preferred. But I don't have the problem on stock tune either. I have to assume it's just one more example of variances in these trucks.

It seems you can choose from 100 trucks on the lot and possibly get a rod throwing time-bomb or a perfect 200,000+ trouble free miler. And anything in between, of course.

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I feel like it has to be because of certain tuning strategy’s. As in strategy codes.
That makes sense, of course.

But I'm seeing folks saying that their truck does it with oem strategy-tune and other trucks not experiencing it.

Or am I confusing the data that's been posted?

If false knock plays a role, it's possible some trucks experience less false-knock. Or you could wonder if some of these motors give off "noises" being sensed as knock by the sensors (falsely) and other motors are just quieter?

For sure there's lots of variance between these trucks when it comes to various noises!

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Fortunately, I'm not one who has experienced this phenomenon, but I have to wonder what could be the cause.

Personally, I would be checking all the heat shields and how close any piping is to frame/cross members. I also think that some Knock sensors could be more sensitive than others. I also do think that there is something to the strategy theory. I mean most tuners are building off the original strategy and using a lot of the stock table settings for scenarios where you are "cruising". If it's there stock, it's there tuned in all cases that I've seen.

Hopefully you figure it out or find a way to get a tuner to adjust the timing tables to mitigate the issue.
 

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There may well be merit to that. My truck also does it stock to a certain extent.

I haven't found anything loose on the exhaust system and it's currently all stock. I've beat and banged and wiggled all over it.

Interesting tidbit of info, my performance/tow tunes with 5* don't do it. At all.

My PERFORMANCE tunes with 5* do, really bad.

Also, I tried having Josh update my p/t tunes to their newest versions (the ones I'm running are 4 years old) and those new revisions of the p/t tunes do it like the performance tunes do.

So I still just run my old files, and those don't do it at all. Not a bit. I hardly see any KR at all.

My performance tunes from Boostking do it a little bit here and there, but nothing like my performance tunes from other companies.

Unless he's holding back on me () he says the only difference he's aware of is he tends to run less initial spark than most tuners.

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I just wonder why its not an issue for everybody if it was the timing tables. My OAR pretty much pegs at -.96 on any tune stock or otherwise. Occasionally, I might see it drop into the -.7 or -.8's, but never any lower. I am only on 91 here.
It seems to be more problematic for Canadians living in Western Canada. Guys in Eastern Canada seem to not get as bad as gas as we do in the West for some reason. Over the last 20 years, the fuel in Western Canada has got worse and worse, with fewer choices for Premium (with a rating above 91). The refineries seem to be the problem. Most of the refineries have shut down over the years, and there are now only a couple. And making crappy gas.

I know dozens of people (including other turbo vehicles too in the Vancouver area), and we all suffer the same problem whatever Premium we use. @Blown F-150 has been experimenting with various Stations selling "94" in his region that actually has ethanol in it - and he's monitoring the amount of ethanol in it. If Blown sees this, he can make his own comments about what he's found.

In the Vancouver region of BC, the top rated gas is called Chevron 94 (with no ethanol). It is good for old carb'd muscle cars, motorcycles and small engines. And if avoids the carb's gumming up over the winter season when they aren't used (though they still should drain their carbs IMO).

But our Chevron 94 is definitely worse than US Chevron 92 that you can get in Washington State. Many turbo guys purposely go to Washington State to get Chevron 92 or Shell 92 instead of the "Chevron 94" in Canada. I myself often do the same, when I go to the Lower Mainland/Vancouver area to visit friends and family.

Personally, I call our Chevron 94 - Chevron 91.5 and I might be generous.
 

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One of the things you can do is have the tuner send you a file with individual knock set up instead of Global. From there, datalog your individual knock per cylinder and see where it's detecting the knock activity from. When you have individual knock per cylinder datalogged, the positive numbers mean it's adding and negative numbers are removing spark. Do this and report back. This way you can somewhat see on what side and area it's coming from.

Also, min load to enter knock activity stock is .4 load, min ECT is 140*F, and min rpm is 800 rpms. Once all of those are met, you should be able to see your knock sensors register activity. If it doesn't, this was adjusted in the tune.
 

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My truck is individual. Oem tune puts cylinder 6 as the offender, most of the custom tunes will have them roughly the same across the board when it occurs.

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My truck is individual. Oem tune puts cylinder 6 as the offender, most of the custom tunes will have them roughly the same across the board when it occurs.

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So is #6 removing spark while the other ones register 0 or add spark or how is it all performing? If that's the case, just look at the driver's side by the firewall and see what you can find that may be causing false knock.
 

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Could this be slap in the tappet for the fuel pump?
 

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This thread is getting somewhere.
A perfect example of the power of group-analysis.

Really cool

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