F150 Ecoboost Forum banner

1 - 20 of 23 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
41 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Ill start by saying that this forum has helped me make some great decisions on upgrades for my F-150 but how can Ford justify the price of these newer trucks when we still have to make expensive upgrades just to make them perform decent. Until this truck I have always been a diesel guy. When I purchased super-duty's in the past the FX-4 package meant at least upgraded rancho shocks which weren't the best but better than super cheap stock shocks! With 40K miles on my 2016 F-150 4x4 which doesn't really go off-road my stock shocks were completely shot to the point where I could compress them with one hand using very little pressure. I had read a bunch of blogs about the stock shocks performance in relation to axle hop and horrible cornering and decided to change the shocks. I put on a set of rear Bilstein 5100's over the weekend and what a day and night difference in how the truck handles everything. A $185 price tag from 4 wheel parts and 30 minutes of work on a 50K truck (are you kidding me) to get a decent ride! I'm hoping the towing aspect will be is as improved as the handling is now. I dont know how everyone else feels but I for one think Ford should rethink their advertised offroad package on these 1/2 tons.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,901 Posts
No offense, but your stock shocks weren't really performing well long before 40,000 miles. :)

OK, I'll try to defend Ford. (And Chevy Dodge.... to some extent)

Half Ton trucks, unlike the heavier duty versions, are the gateway drug, oooops, I mean truck. They ALSO are the best selling vehicles in all the land. As a result, folks "first truck" is far more likely to be a ½ton than SuperDuty. (unless there's a new requirement in the household that never existed before.... like a 5th wheel purchase)

So, as it was explained to me by a fella that had been selling cars/trucks for 4 decades, the modern F150 is intentionally designed to give a first-timer a very specific experience on their test drive. And since test drives are in empty unloaded trucks? Well, that's a problem.

The salesman has heard the potential customer say "wow, this thing doesn't ride anything like I expected. It's so smooth...... blah blah blah"

He even went on to claim that once one of the manufacturers took this approach it forced the others to change in that direction or risk the uneducated buyer making his decision to buy the competitors truck because your truck "rides poorly"

I obviously don't know how much truth there is to the story, but it kinda holds up. (in my opinion)

My suggestion to the manufacturer is to openly offer an "upgrade" from the factory and label it as "heavy duty" suspension. And the Bilsteins would be the PERFECT option since other manufacturers have done exactly that in their performance cars. Incredibly inexpensive for the manufacturer and yet another avenue for increased profits.

So far Ford hasn't heeded my advice. Lol

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
7,822 Posts
I have my stock shocks from my 2018 F150 (non-FX4) that I will sell you for cheap if you are interested? Only on the truck for 8K miles.


On another note, I'm not 100% sure how much the aluminum body helps or how the 2013 vs 2018 suspension is different...but my 2018 XLT Sport with the stock shocks rode 5 times better than my 2013 FX4 rode whether it was brand new or when I traded it in with 76K miles. The shocks on that truck were STIFF! Take it FWIW
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,560 Posts
No offense, but your stock shocks weren't really performing well long before 40,000 miles. :)

OK, I'll try to defend Ford. (And Chevy Dodge.... to some extent)

Half Ton trucks, unlike the heavier duty versions, are the gateway drug, oooops, I mean truck. They ALSO are the best selling vehicles in all the land. As a result, folks "first truck" is far more likely to be a ½ton than SuperDuty. (unless there's a new requirement in the household that never existed before.... like a 5th wheel purchase)

So, as it was explained to me by a fella that had been selling cars/trucks for 4 decades, the modern F150 is intentionally designed to give a first-timer a very specific experience on their test drive. And since test drives are in empty unloaded trucks? Well, that's a problem.

The salesman has heard the potential customer say "wow, this thing doesn't ride anything like I expected. It's so smooth...... blah blah blah"

He even went on to claim that once one of the manufacturers took this approach it forced the others to change in that direction or risk the uneducated buyer making his decision to buy the competitors truck because your truck "rides poorly"

I obviously don't know how much truth there is to the story, but it kinda holds up. (in my opinion)

My suggestion to the manufacturer is to openly offer an "upgrade" from the factory and label it as "heavy duty" suspension. And the Bilsteins would be the PERFECT option since other manufacturers have done exactly that in their performance cars. Incredibly inexpensive for the manufacturer and yet another avenue for increased profits.

So far Ford hasn't heeded my advice. Lol

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
The issue I take with this is that even the unloaded ride on my stock truck was dog ****. I bought my Bilstein's because I had the truck buck so hard off a mid-corner bump that it got sideways and the Advancetrac had to save me from flying into a jersey barrier. This was doing the speed limit on a highway on-ramp.

The bilsteins were a substantial improvement all around. Even though the are technically firmer, I think it smooths out the ride by calming down the shudders and shimmies that were present with the stock shocks.

And I can tell you right now that the stock Ram's ride far better than the stock F150's, and I would say they are just about as good as my truck with the Bilsteins. I had a 2018 Big Horn Hemi 4x4 in Houston a couple months back for 5 days, and I just had a 2019 Rebel quad cab in San Antonio for 3 days. Ford just hugely sucks in this regard, but luckily its a fairly cheap fix.

I havent driven the GM's, but I know the new Denali actually got rated better than a 2019 Ram Limited hovercraft with air suspension in terms of ride.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
7,822 Posts
And I can tell you right now that the stock Ram's ride far better than the stock F150's, and I would say they are just about as good as my truck with the Bilsteins. I had a 2018 Big Horn Hemi 4x4 in Houston a couple months back for 5 days, and I just had a 2019 Rebel quad cab in San Antonio for 3 days. Ford just hugely sucks in this regard, but luckily its a fairly cheap fix.
If I'm not mistaken, newer Dodge trucks have coil springs on all 4 corners unlike the F150's that only have them in the front
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,621 Posts
If you're complaining about the lack of upgraded shocks with the FX4, you better not crawl underneath and get a good look at the "skid plates" you got for the price!

What does that mean? Those things are pretty thick metal and heavy?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
41 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
My friends everything nowadays is a money making opportunity for everyone except the consumer!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,047 Posts
I could think of 10 other engine parts that were done on the cheap before I complain about the stock shocks. Look at it this way, shocks are cheap and easy to replace or "upgrade". Ever try upgrading a piston? I think I get what you're saying is the base truck is made with super cheap parts, then what was once an "upgrade" by buying into a higher trim, is all just smoke and mirrors. Sound about right?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
41 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
You are correct DNA Dan about the tons of mechanical shortcuts but I think my problem is about principals. Over time these manufacturers including Ford choose to build cheaper and cut corners to reduce costs and increase profits and we forget how the quality used to be in the things we still continue to buy. Just like why in the world they put seat material on the armrest of center console for the jumpseat in the XLT but put black leatherish material on door panel armrests. I continually have to clean it because of normal body oils and dirt that accumulate from resting our arms on it. As much as I love this truck there's tons of little things I despise.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
45 Posts
If I'm not mistaken, newer Dodge trucks have coil springs on all 4 corners unlike the F150's that only have them in the front
Correct. In my opinion the rams ride the nicest out of all of the half tons, with or without the air suspension. My 2014 ecodiesel was excellent in this regard. However, they sag more under load. Ride of my previous 2016 sierra was slightly better than the f150 but it’s a truck at the of the day and the rest of the f-150 beats the pants off of the sierra.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,047 Posts
Over time these manufacturers including Ford choose to build cheaper and cut corners to reduce costs and increase profits and we forget how the quality used to be in the things we still continue to buy.
I don't think folks have necessarily forgotten..... It's just that we live in a different time. Resources that were cheap and available 20-30+ years ago are outrageously expensive or unavailable now. Remember when plastic was the cheap alternative? It's a sign of the times and expect things to get worse with more people on the planet and less resources to go around. Certainly this "disposable reality" that we are currently living in will be unsustainable several years from now. That's why you have to squeeze that lemon!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,901 Posts
Perspective.

"The good Ole days" are something I can defend at one angle, and yet the standard of living available to modern man is another that I am in awe of.

My truck, whether it has corners cut or not, would be Science Fiction to my grandpa. (who lived to 99 but has been gone for 25)

He'd probably look at me like I lost my mind if I pointed out it was damped poorly from Ford. Lol

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22 Posts
I don't think folks have necessarily forgotten..... It's just that we live in a different time. Resources that were cheap and available 20-30+ years ago are outrageously expensive or unavailable now. Remember when plastic was the cheap alternative? It's a sign of the times and expect things to get worse with more people on the planet and less resources to go around. Certainly this "disposable reality" that we are currently living in will be unsustainable several years from now. That's why you have to squeeze that lemon!
Most things are made with robots because the human equivalent would be outrageously expensive and slower. injected and thermo-formed panels and trim, micro circuit electronics, things have gotten to the point you CAN'T work on them. They have to be replaced to be repaired.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,635 Posts
Most things are made with robots because the human equivalent would be outrageously expensive and slower. injected and thermo-formed panels and trim, micro circuit electronics, things have gotten to the point you CAN'T work on them. They have to be replaced to be repaired.
That mindset is pretty much the way it is. I first noticed this mentality with microwave ovens. Nobody fixed microwave ovens after they were on the market for 10 years. These are viewed as consumables and are simply a disposable item. TV’s are another place you can attach a time frame to when this started happening.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,560 Posts
If I'm not mistaken, newer Dodge trucks have coil springs on all 4 corners unlike the F150's that only have them in the front
Thats right, or air bags on all 4 corners if you option them. Supposedly the air bags ride like heaven. I have only driven the coil sprung trucks and they ride very nice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
304 Posts
I can sympathize with the OP regarding the FX4 "package". You'd think it would get upgraded shocks and a rear sway bar as part of the package, to live up to the "FX4" offroad image. I think the TRD package on my 2005 Toyota Tundra 4x4 has better shocks and real skid plates, but then again, it's 14 years old. I installed a Hellwig rear sway bar and replaced the stock OEM rear shocks with a set of KYBs, and it handles a LOT better. Like has been said, new rear shocks and a rear sway bar didn't break the bank, but Ford should've put those things on as part of the FX4 package. I test drove a 2018 Ram Big Horn, had the coil spring suspension, rear sway bar, and Hemi engine. But I wanted a console shift and no chrome, which would've meant upgrading to a Sport model, which cost more than the Big Horn, so I ended up with the F150. I don't really haul or tow anything on a regular basis, so no need for air bags like a Ram would have, and IMO, my F150 rides pretty nice now.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,901 Posts
An F150, or a Ram, or a...... Almost ANY oem vehicle, has enormous low hanging fruit if you are someone who appreciates good handling. And like so many things in consumerism, you get what you pay for.

Go test drive a brand new Miata in "Club" trim. It's super light. Has an upgraded suspension. Your initial response will likely be that it is a fantastic handling little hooligan car.

Then drive one with one of the various aftermarket coilover kits. NIGHT AND DAY!

Our trucks are no different. In fact, even more so since the starting point is so low.

Bilsteins are almost unanimously championed for their improvement to the F150. And I agree. But, that's still a far cry from how amazing you can get one of these trucks to handle with high-end suspension tuning. You have to experience it to know, of course. But it's not magic. It's just costly compared to cheaper components.



Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
45 Posts
An F150, or a Ram, or a...... Almost ANY oem vehicle, has enormous low hanging fruit if you are someone who appreciates good handling. And like so many things in consumerism, you get what you pay for.

Go test drive a brand new Miata in "Club" trim. It's super light. Has an upgraded suspension. Your initial response will likely be that it is a fantastic handling little hooligan car.

Then drive one with one of the various aftermarket coilover kits. NIGHT AND DAY!

Our trucks are no different. In fact, even more so since the starting point is so low.

Bilsteins are almost unanimously championed for their improvement to the F150. And I agree. But, that's still a far cry from how amazing you can get one of these trucks to handle with high-end suspension tuning. You have to experience it to know, of course. But it's not magic. It's just costly compared to cheaper components.



Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
True story. I experienced the same with the 03 focus svt I had years ago. Out of the box it was a hoot... but after a torsen diff and a powerworks supercharger it became clear that I needed suspension, which it got. It became one of the most fun vehicles I’ve ever had despite always needing something fixed. Kind of wish I was still fixing it.
 
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
Top